Comments on: Leadership Dilemma: If a child swears at a teacher what should you do?

By: dave

dave — Fri, 22 Jan 2010 22:56:20 +0000

i recently been excluded for swearing directly at a teacher, but when teachers provoke one such as myself they abuse their position as i did a presentation and the teacher refused to see it and she wanted to tell the head of 6th form so i swore

By: Joan

Joan — Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:30:37 +0000

I’m here because my 16 year old son swore at his teacher on Friday and has been suspended from school for one day, today. I admit to swearing occasionally — quite non-graphically “oh, shit”. My son used much more graphic unacceptable language. He said it in front of other students. Yes, he deserves to be punished. You can call it exclusion — he calls it a “day off”! I don’t see this as a solution at all. I am looking for a way to “reach him” and teach him that this is hurting himself as a person. He’s been to counseling, takes Prozac for depression and is failing all his classes. A day off is not going to matter to him, but at least it shows other students who may still care, that there is a consequence to pay for such verbal abuse to a teacher. I would really like to see him write a sincere letter of apology to the teacher and read it aloud in front of the students who witnessed the verbal abuse. That’s like asking for a miracle! He can’t stand the teacher which is what caused the outbreak in the first place. He claims that the teacher refused to help him with a math problem claiming in front of the class, that he should have paid attention to begin with. Although I agree that he should have been paying attention, I’m sure that was not a response that helped matters. Thus, the swearing. If anyone can offer advice on how to get him to do the right thing even though she did not, (especially considering she is an adult educator and he is not fully in control of himself yet), I would be grateful. Thanks. Joan

By: oldandrew

oldandrew — Sat, 03 May 2008 19:30:09 +0000

“Consider what it means for a pupil to swear at a teacher. It means that the relationship between them has become broken.”

No, it doesn’t. Plenty of pupils swear at complete strangers with whom they have no relationship at all.

Moreover, relationships are a two-way street. If we start making out that relationships are the key to behaving appropriately then we are handing ultimate power over to the pupils, as they are always free to withhold a good relationship with a member of staff.

Students need to know that swearing at adults is unacceptable, regardless of how they feel about that adult. I am more and more inclined towards the “always exclude” camp. The only exception should be if there are overwhelming exceptional circumstances and the member of staff involved agrees.

By: Bill

Bill — Fri, 02 May 2008 18:02:09 +0000

“Swearing is industry language. For as long as we’re alive it’s not going to change. You’ve got to be boisterous to get results”

Gordon Ramsay

I agree Dave the media(quotes like above don’t help I guess) has an effect on this argument and pupils I think often use this form of language out of frustration and without knowing the real effect and harm it can cause to others. The conflict situation that arises from these incidents can often lead to a chance or opportunity to solve more deep rooted underlying problems. as for a solution in the school I agree with Dave ..too many variables.

By: Dave

Dave — Thu, 01 May 2008 15:29:09 +0000

A thorny and perennial one. In my secondary school, staff expect a swearing pupil to be excluded every time - “zero tolerance” is often quoted. I prefer to look at the whole circumstances, not only the word used, but the lead-up. Surely the first key issue is appropriate action? There can sometimes be a development issue for a teacher too, without undermining their classroom authority, and I often work with that teacher to support them avoiding a similar incident again. This isn’t a soft approach - the pupil’s parents are always contacted, whether they are excluded or not, then I always feedback to the teacher. The first key issue is appropriate behaviour and making it clear what is expected by staff (and an employer) - it’s hard to say “by society” as the “f” word especially is in such daily use in the media, in sport and on the street that I believe we have to balance respect and credibility for staff within that context too. The third key issue then is to involve staff in the decision-making and involve staff within a genuine restorative approach. Time-consuming - yes. Effective - very often.

By: Norman Roxburgh

Norman Roxburgh — Thu, 01 May 2008 11:45:52 +0000

A very interesting discussion and many good points.
I do not like automatic punishments. I have seen them lead to very unjust punishments
In dealing with a serious incident it is important that the teacher is satisfied with the action taken. A pupil can be withdrawn from all classes while action is decided. It is often a good outcome, if the parent and pupil finish up being grateful to the teacher for not insisting on the most severe punishment.
The pupil can be kept from classes until a meeting with a parent and can be withdrawn from the teacher’s class for some time. (in consultation with the teacher.)
It is important that the incident, the action, the apologies and the warnings are recorded in a letter to the parent. The teacher should check the contents of the letter before it is sent.

By: David Gilmour

David Gilmour — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 23:59:28 +0000

@Robert: No, I was being careful not to suggest that exclusions caused criminality. Any relationship will be complex, and will involve lots of other variables. But it’s not hard to imagine that exclusion could contribute to a reduced sense of belonging to the school community, and that this might be a step towards the reduced sense of belonging to the wider community that makes breaking its laws seem acceptable.

By: Jen

Jen — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:35:01 +0000

Catriona, I understand your point but I think we also need to remember that we are also preparing pupils for life in the “real world”. If we decide that swearing at anyone in school is not a problem, are we really preparing these pupils for the future life of work (would you want someone swearing at you in a shop because they were annoyed at something you said - and would their employer say it’s Ok that’s just what they do at home?).

I like the idea of involving the teacher and must say that when this has happened to me there hasn’t been pressure and I have found it positive.

By: Kenneth McLaughlin

Kenneth McLaughlin — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 16:32:38 +0000

It’s a shame that this discussion centres around the actions and reactions rather than exploring the issue. For me the key issue is addressing the disitegration of the relationship between pupil & teacher.

Consider what it means for a pupil to swear at a teacher. It means that the relationship between them has become broken. The question then turns to how as a head teacher do I help repair the relationship? If exclusion is the only method used then the underlying tensions and reasons for the swearing have not been addressed. I need to discuss with the pupil and possibly his/her parents the implications of the pupils action. I would give the pupil the option of apologising and addressing the negative attitude to the teacher while having the threat of an exclusion. I suppose (simplistically) I want them to shake hands and get back to work.

By: Donald

Donald — Mon, 28 Apr 2008 22:26:19 +0000

As a practising headteacher I do exclude if a pupil swears at a member of staff. I would add that there is a real dilemma created for me when a pupil swears at a member of staff. I am well aware that I am not necessarily resolving the issue by excluding the pupil, but, I do believe that I am taking a step towards reducing the likelihood of the swearing happening again and, importantly, making a public statement that swearing at or threatening staff is totally unacceptable and will not be tolerated. In my school, in the past three years, only two pupils have been suspended on more than one occasion for swearing at staff.I.e. repeat offending. Pupils at my school know that swearing at a member of staff is a line they must not cross or they will be excluded. This applies to all staff, regardless of their role at the school or their position. On some occasions, because of the circumstances, I have decided not to exclude. In all such cases the reasons are made clear to both the member of staff concerned, the pupil and the family concerned.